That was in the TL as a fictional idea, not a real value. 4 stroke naturally aspirated diesels get oofed hard in WW2.
Sir John Valentine Carden Survives. Part 2.
- Thread starter allanpcameron
- Start date
Well boring the cylinders out ought to allow you to use the same con-rods and crank-shart.
With the meteor they removed a great deal from the Merlin to simplify it's construction and make it lighter including the super charger. If they have gone with a naturally asperated engine then maybe is could be modified to have a turbo charger fitted to it even a small one to get more air into the engine to improve the combustion rate of the fuel in question. It's something that has been around for ages by this point in the timeline and could really help in engine operation and range.
One should remember that the OTL Meteor in WW2 had to run on Pool petrol of @74 octane. Superchargers introduce inlet air heating by compression so whilst one would gain inlet air pressure one also loses density through heating and pre ignition (‘knocking’) more readily. Most of the solutions add even more weight and complexity so require more power to haul them around and maintenance, not to mention making even more components. The normally aspirated route is simpler, lighter, more easily maintained and allows more common items to the mass Merlin output including accepting reject Merlin parts. It was the right answer to wartime needs and gave a quite adequate power output for the task in hand. Now if you can get a separate Armoured logistics fuel supply then aero engine petrol could make a difference but it complicates POL supply lines to little benefit. No, they got it right IOTL.
Abjure all superchargers, turbochargers, fancy petrol, petrol injection and water injection. KISS is the watchword.
Abjure all superchargers, turbochargers, fancy petrol, petrol injection and water injection. KISS is the watchword.
IOTL, the US M4A2s and M10s were powered quite handily by the GM 6046 (paired Detroit Diesel 6-71s) during WW2. The AEC A190 (131hp) diesel was of comparable power to the 6-71, reliable and preferred by Vickers for the OTL Valentine from the beginning, unlike the unreliable AEC A189 (135hp) petrol insisted upon by the War Department. Seeing as how the GM 6046 is a GM product and that GM purchased Vauxhall in 1925, I don't see why both it and the 6-71 couldn't be produced at GM's Vauxhall plant in the UK. This, at the very least, could buy the time needed to develop the Meteor/Meteorite engines, while at the same time allowing the British military to transition away from petrol as its main fuel earlier.
The M101 V8 Meteorite should be 350hp at 1800rpm. Wikipedia has the wrong numbers but the right source for whatever reason.
I gather that it became a marine diesel, spmetimes known as the Rover Meteorite. Here is a 10 year old video of one for sale in Portugal.
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ITTL I think you have a proven path for turning aero engines into diesels, giving the Meteor to Perkins to convert will utilise a seperate design team that now has experience in this area.
I wonder if in a similar vein to making the Meteor out of cast iron, could the single stage centrifugal supercharger be made out of steel instead of aircraft grade alloy, it will be heavier and sap some power, hopefully the boost in power would be a net gain.
TBH most of the engine bodies now are made of cast iron or steel for important stuff they are made of various alloys and the like I’m talking things like the cylinder liner the piston heads, surfaces that can experience a lot of wear like cams for timing, injector nozzles and the like, there is more but this is off the top of my head.
Missing Threadmark.
British reinforcements keep arriving, with more and more tanks. Meanwhile, the Japanese don't even get any anti-tank weapons. Do the Thai's in the region have any? I wouldn't think so.
Most of their heavy guns are Japanese with a few old British mountain guns.
Isn't this a solution?
14 December 1941. Chertsey, England:
"Ricardo and Perkins had been working with The Old Gang on the super heavy tank and had a V12 diesel currently producing 600hp which Ricardo believed could be improved upon."
14 December 1941. Chertsey, England:
"Ricardo and Perkins had been working with The Old Gang on the super heavy tank and had a V12 diesel currently producing 600hp which Ricardo believed could be improved upon."
Are you sure on that? I thought that the Antar Mk 2 or 3 was given a new Rolls Royce Diesel in part because it gave more power at around 320hp.
About as sure as it is reasonably possible to be. Those are the figures given on page 135 of the Rolls-Royce Heritage Trust book on the subject (ISBN 1 872922 24 4) so you'd hope that they are correct. The wikipedia article has the same source listed but it looks like the performance numbers were added separately six months ago from an IP number that is part of an address range that was blocked for "disruptive editing", so there's no indication where they came from.
23 February 1942. Darwin, Australia.
allanpcameron
Donor
23 February 1942. Darwin, Australia.
The Australian port had become one of the most important hubs of supplies running between Australia and the Dutch East Indies. The feeling around the town was it was becoming more American by the day. The airfield was awash with P40s, A20s, A24s, B17s, even some LB24s. Many of the aircraft were transiting towards the main airfields in Java, but pursuit squadrons were on constant alert.
There had been another Pearl Harbour type attack against Surabaya, which seemed to include the involvement of possibly four Japanese aircraft carriers. Unlike Pearl Harbour, not everything had gone Japan’s way. The radar had provided early warning and the Japanese aircraft had been met with strong resistance. Claims about how many aircraft had been shot down, most likely massively overestimated, gave the allies a boost. The fact was that KM Java had been sunk, and USS Houston, HMS Exeter and HMAS Perth had all suffered some damage. Three destroyers (USS Paul Jones, HMS Jupiter, KM Kortenaer) had also been sunk, and three others were damaged.
A number of other civilian ships were sunk or damaged, and the port installation had also been degraded. The local airfields had also been attacked, and some aircraft had been destroyed on the ground. The Japanese aircraft carriers had managed to avoid being spotted either by aerial reconnaissance or submarine sighting, and had presumably retired from the area. The effect on the ABDAfloat Combined Striking Force had been catastrophic. With thoughts of offensive action having to be put on hold.
Darwin’s role had become all the more important with the damage done to Surabaya. The constant stream of American reinforcements arrived at the larger Australian ports, spent some time training, then would be fed into Darwin, either overland or by coastal traffic. From Darwin they were sent to the on-going battle on Celebes, or to reinforce Java or other East Indies islands.
The Australian Brigades on Ambon and Timor had to be maintained and some coastal shipping had been diverted to Papua New Guinea where they were being used to evacuate the Australian troops from New Britain. Brigadier Stanley Savage’s 17 Brigade had given a good account of themselves defending Rabaul. The evacuation shipping took the Australians to Lae initially. They would then be shipped back to Australia, the sick having priority.
There had been discussions about reinforcing the 1st Independent Company that was looking after the defence of Vila (New Hebrides), Tulagi (Guadalcanal), Buka Passage (Bougainville), and Lorengau (Manus Island). There had been no word from the detachment on New Ireland and all were posted missing. Reinforcing the forward air observation line, unless with large forces, would likely mean that if the Japanese did move on these places, it would mean the death or capture of the Australians, without any clear gain.
As much as the Intelligence services could gather, it was believed that the defence of Rabaul had gutted the Japanese infantry force sent to capture it. It was therefore believed that the Japanese were having to consolidate their gain there, while waiting for reinforcements to move further into the Solomon Islands. Some kind of radio traffic suggested that the Japanese were worried that the Australian 17 Brigade might attempt to retake Rabaul. Delaying the Japanese expansion was a decent result, but once they were able to establish air bases, it would be difficult to stop them.
The voices of American troops were heard as another vehicle convoy approached the docks. The 1st and 2nd Battalions of 147th Field Artillery Regiment (South Dakota National Guard), 1st Bn 148th FAR (Idaho NG) had initially been designated to protect Darwin. The possibility of an invasion of Australia was highly unlikely, and the Texan National Guard (2nd Bn 131st FAR) at Kendari had provided the American press with a positive story. Major-General Julian Barnes had agreed to release the two battalions to reinforce the Texans on Celebes. Under the designation of 26th US Field Artillery Brigade (CO Colonel Albert Searle), along with two Australian Infantry Battalions moving from Timor, these reinforcements would hopefully keep Kendari out of Japanese hands, protecting Java.
The Australian port had become one of the most important hubs of supplies running between Australia and the Dutch East Indies. The feeling around the town was it was becoming more American by the day. The airfield was awash with P40s, A20s, A24s, B17s, even some LB24s. Many of the aircraft were transiting towards the main airfields in Java, but pursuit squadrons were on constant alert.
There had been another Pearl Harbour type attack against Surabaya, which seemed to include the involvement of possibly four Japanese aircraft carriers. Unlike Pearl Harbour, not everything had gone Japan’s way. The radar had provided early warning and the Japanese aircraft had been met with strong resistance. Claims about how many aircraft had been shot down, most likely massively overestimated, gave the allies a boost. The fact was that KM Java had been sunk, and USS Houston, HMS Exeter and HMAS Perth had all suffered some damage. Three destroyers (USS Paul Jones, HMS Jupiter, KM Kortenaer) had also been sunk, and three others were damaged.
A number of other civilian ships were sunk or damaged, and the port installation had also been degraded. The local airfields had also been attacked, and some aircraft had been destroyed on the ground. The Japanese aircraft carriers had managed to avoid being spotted either by aerial reconnaissance or submarine sighting, and had presumably retired from the area. The effect on the ABDAfloat Combined Striking Force had been catastrophic. With thoughts of offensive action having to be put on hold.
Darwin’s role had become all the more important with the damage done to Surabaya. The constant stream of American reinforcements arrived at the larger Australian ports, spent some time training, then would be fed into Darwin, either overland or by coastal traffic. From Darwin they were sent to the on-going battle on Celebes, or to reinforce Java or other East Indies islands.
The Australian Brigades on Ambon and Timor had to be maintained and some coastal shipping had been diverted to Papua New Guinea where they were being used to evacuate the Australian troops from New Britain. Brigadier Stanley Savage’s 17 Brigade had given a good account of themselves defending Rabaul. The evacuation shipping took the Australians to Lae initially. They would then be shipped back to Australia, the sick having priority.
There had been discussions about reinforcing the 1st Independent Company that was looking after the defence of Vila (New Hebrides), Tulagi (Guadalcanal), Buka Passage (Bougainville), and Lorengau (Manus Island). There had been no word from the detachment on New Ireland and all were posted missing. Reinforcing the forward air observation line, unless with large forces, would likely mean that if the Japanese did move on these places, it would mean the death or capture of the Australians, without any clear gain.
As much as the Intelligence services could gather, it was believed that the defence of Rabaul had gutted the Japanese infantry force sent to capture it. It was therefore believed that the Japanese were having to consolidate their gain there, while waiting for reinforcements to move further into the Solomon Islands. Some kind of radio traffic suggested that the Japanese were worried that the Australian 17 Brigade might attempt to retake Rabaul. Delaying the Japanese expansion was a decent result, but once they were able to establish air bases, it would be difficult to stop them.
The voices of American troops were heard as another vehicle convoy approached the docks. The 1st and 2nd Battalions of 147th Field Artillery Regiment (South Dakota National Guard), 1st Bn 148th FAR (Idaho NG) had initially been designated to protect Darwin. The possibility of an invasion of Australia was highly unlikely, and the Texan National Guard (2nd Bn 131st FAR) at Kendari had provided the American press with a positive story. Major-General Julian Barnes had agreed to release the two battalions to reinforce the Texans on Celebes. Under the designation of 26th US Field Artillery Brigade (CO Colonel Albert Searle), along with two Australian Infantry Battalions moving from Timor, these reinforcements would hopefully keep Kendari out of Japanese hands, protecting Java.
allanpcameron
Donor
So, the attack on Darwin OTL took place instead on Surabaya. With the Japanese not holding Kendari and Ambon, then getting the Japanese aircraft carriers in range to strike Darwin seemed likely. Therefore Surabaya targeted ITTL means that the Australians are less prone to invasion fever. The losses to the ABDA fleet do affect some things to come, but they were all lost OTL anyway for little advantage, also Houston, Exeter and Perth's damage means they're more likely to head off somewhere safe for repairs.
Allan
Allan
I figured Surabaya was more akin to the Indian Ocean Raid actually...
Huh, I would have thought that Blucher Tharp would be promoted considering ITTL, this is the first victory that involved American troops and with the headlines in the US probably being like 'How the Texans saved Kendari!'