Rebels against Henry IV win, split England

Max Sinister

Banned
This is inspired by no one lesser than Shakespeare: In a description of Henry IV Part 1 I read what they had planned: Glendower gets all the land along the Severn, Mortimer gets the south of England up to the river Trent, and "Hotspur" Percy gets the north of England.

So, if they won - how'd the map look like, and what'd happen next? Under other circumstances, split countries can unite again, but if there are three parts and neither is strong enough to overwhelm the other two? Will England never be a great power? If there is colonization of America (plausible enough), will the new states participate? How?
 
Gwrtheyrn Annwn

Gwrtheyrn Annwn

Max Sinister said:
This is inspired by no one lesser than Shakespeare: In a description of Henry IV Part 1 I read what they had planned: Glendower gets all the land along the Severn, Mortimer gets the south of England up to the river Trent, and "Hotspur" Percy gets the north of England.

So, if they won - how'd the map look like, and what'd happen next? Under other circumstances, split countries can unite again, but if there are three parts and neither is strong enough to overwhelm the other two? Will England never be a great power? If there is colonization of America (plausible enough), will the new states participate? How?
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Skallagrim said:
I know that @Gwrtheyrn Annwn made a very beautiful map for this exact scenario, which can be found here.
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Yep, that map is pretty much this question in a nutshell. I'm flattered you remembered it. :p

As for what happens next, I've written an entire TL on exactly that (see my sig). I'm personally of the belief that Mortimer England would become a prosperous merchant state, trading with the markets of the Netherlands and may well participate in the colonisation of America in a manner probably best akin to the Dutch participation IOTL. Wales might flirt with it, not least because of this https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Madoc, but any lasting colonies are unlikely. Northumbria, however, is unlikely to have the resources for such exploration and is much more likely to follow a Scotland-esque path.
 
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Gwrtheyrn Annwn

Gwrtheyrn Annwn

P L Richards said:
Yes, we really need someone to do a TL along the lines of 'WI Prince Madog ab Owain Gwynedd had really existed, and had sailed across the Atlantic?', don't we?:) Less ASB-ishly, it'd be nice if, way down the line, an independant Wales managed to colonise Patagonia...
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I'm going to lie, I have considered it for my TL but given it's still 1453 it's probably a little early. :p
 

MiniaAr

I'm worried about Northumbria there. Isn't there a big chance that Scotland would like a big chunk of Northumbria? Wasn't Cumbria a part of the Kingdom of Strathclyde which the Scots claimed for themselves?

In case of a Scotland-Northumbria war, I expect both England and Wales to share the rest than to give help to Northumbria.
 
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