Map Thread XXII

[vgh...]

So did another in my series of religious demography maps, this time for the Irreligious population.

NOTES:
1. Irreligious includes Atheists, Agnostics and those who fit into the category of Spiritual But Not Religious.
2. There are quite a few places that are shown as Insufficient Data that have large Irreligious populations; I have included a list of all the I/D polities below this notes section.
3. I've used a mixture of self-identification AND secondary polling (namely 'Do you believe in (a) God?') for this map as there are a very large amount of people in various countries (mostly Europe) who will answer that they're Christian or Muslim but when asked if they believe in god will answer that they don't.


View attachment 898313

Insufficient Data:
Abkhazia - No data available.
Albania - No reliable data; government records have been deemed unreliable and NGO polling shows massive differences in results, ranging from 2.5-63% . My personal estimate is in the 35-45% range.
Angola - The last official census (2014) lies outside of my acceptable time ranges and no recent enough NGO polling exists; the last official numbers were 12%. My personal estimate is in the 13-18% range.
Anguilla - The last official census (2011) lies outside of my acceptable time ranges and no recent enough NGO polling exists; the last official numbers were 4%. My personal estimate is in the 4-7% range.
Ascension - Ascension does not have a permanent population.
Azerbaijan -No reliable data; government and NGO polling often show wildly different results. My personal estimate is in the 15-25% range.
Bahrain - Data not recorded; roughly 18% of Bahrain's population are not Muslim, however the government does not differentiate beyond that and NGO polling is not specific enough. My personal estimate is in the 1-5% range.
Barbados - The last official census (2010) lies outside of my acceptable time ranges and no recent enough NGO polling exists; the last official numbers were 1.9%. My personal estimate is in the 2-5% range.
Belize - The last official census (2010) lies outside of my acceptable time ranges and no recent enough NGO polling exists; the last official numbers were 15.5%. My personal estimate is in the 16-20% range.
Bermuda - The last reliable estimates (2010) lies outside of my acceptable time ranges; the last official numbers were 17.8%. My personal estimate is in the 19-25% range.
British Virgin Islands - The last official census (2010) lies outside of my acceptable time ranges and no recent enough NGO polling exists; the last official numbers were 15.5%. My personal estimate is in the 16-20% range.
Burma - No reliable data; the government does not recognize Irreligious groups, the existing data is out of date (2014), the official numbers are suspect and the civil war is likely changing demographics. My personal estimate is in the 3-15% range.
Cyprus - The last official census (2010) lies outside of my acceptable time ranges and no recent enough NGO polling exists, additionally the government has a habit of lumping everything that's not Christianity or Islam into one category; the last official numbers were 0.6%. My personal estimate is in the 1-4% range.
Eritrea - No reliable data; the Eritrean government does not conduct accurate censuses or polling nor does it recognize any religious groups outside of Sunni Islam or the four specific Christian denominations it's chosen, in addition what numbers it does provide are to further its own propaganda; more recent NGO and U.S. estimates vary wildly. My personal estimate is in the 0.5-5% range.
Faroe Islands - The last official census (2011) lies outside of my acceptable time ranges and no recent enough NGO polling exists; the last official numbers were 4%. My personal estimate is in the 5-10% range.
Grenada - The last official census (2011) lies outside of my acceptable time ranges and no recent enough NGO polling exists; the last official numbers were 5.7%. My personal estimate is in the 6-10% range.
Guernsey - No data available.
Hungary - Insufficient Data; the last census (2022) is essentially unusable as a source as 40% of the population did not answer the question on religion; the official numbers for those answering was 16.1%. My personal estimate is in the 20-55% range.
Iran - No reliable data; as the Iranian government is a Theocracy it not only undercounts religious minorities, but does not recognize Irreligious groups, additionally NGO polling varies significantly from Less than 1% to 18%. My personal estimate is in the 5-10% range.
ISIL - No data available.
Korea, N. - Insufficient Data; the government does not collect records on religious demographics and only recognizes a very limited number of religious groups, additionally there are no recent estimates from any reliable NGOs. My personal estimate is in the 65-85% range.
Kurdistan - No reliable data; the government does not collect data on religious demography and NGO estimates vary greatly from Less than 1% to 15%, additionally recent events (ISIL, COVID) are shown to have affected the identity and importance of religion among the population. My personal estimate is in the 1-5% range.
Laos - No reliable data; the government only recognizes four religions and does not tend to publish information on religious demography, additionally the last major NGO polling was from 2015 and lumped Irreligion and 'Other' Religions into the same category. My personal estimate is in the 2-15% range.
Lebanon - No reliable data; the government has not conducted a census or collected data on religious demographics since 1932 and generally discourages doing so, NGO polling tends to not be particularly reliable and the influx of refugees from the Syrian Civil War will have changed numbers as well. My personal estimate is in the 10-20% range.
Monaco - No reliable data; the government does not actively collect information on religious demographics, additionally existing major NGO polling (2012) lies outside of my acceptable time ranges; the last major polling numbers were 11.7%. My personal estimate is in the 15-25% range.
Nepal - No reliable data; the government does not recognize Irreligious options in its census and polling, additionally there's not much in terms of NGO polling. My personal estimate is in the 5-15% range.
Russia - No reliable data; while the Russian government records religious demographics these numbers are not reliable, additionally NGO polling numbers vary wildly from 5-40%. My personal estimate is in the 25-35% range.
Saint Lucia - The last official census (2010) lies outside of my acceptable time ranges and no recent enough NGO polling exists; the last official numbers were 5.9%. My personal estimate is in the 6-10% range.
Saint Vincent and the Grenadines - The last official census (2012) lies outside of my acceptable time ranges and no recent enough NGO polling exists; the last official numbers were 7.5%. My personal estimate is in the 8-11% range.
São Tomé and Príncipe - No reliable data; The last official census (2012) lies outside of my acceptable time ranges and no recent enough NGO polling exists; the last official numbers were 21.2%. My personal estimate is in the 22-28% range.
Sint Maarten - No reliable data; The last official census (2011) lies outside of my acceptable time ranges and no recent enough NGO polling exists; the last official numbers were 7.9%. My personal estimate is in the 10-15% range.
South Ossetia - No data available.
Syria - No reliable data; the government has not conducted a census or collected data on religious demographics since the 1960's, what NGO polling exists doesn't tend to record irreligious groups and the Civil War has massively altered the countries demography. My personal estimate is in the 10-20% range.
Tokelau - No reliable data; the last official numbers (2011) on religious demographics lie outside of my acceptable time ranges and do not seem to include Irreligious options, additionally there is no recent NGO polling. My personal estimate is in the 0.5-3% range.
Transnistria - No reliable data; the last official numbers (2012) on religious demographics lie outside of my acceptable time ranges, additionally the government numbers are themself suspect. My personal estimate is in the 1-10% range.
Trinidad and Tobago - No reliable data; The last official census (2011) lies outside of my acceptable time ranges, includes three categories that likely have overlap for the Irreligious population and no recent enough NGO polling exists; the last official numbers were 2.2%. My personal estimate is in the 4-8% range.
Tristan da Cunha - No reliable data; official census and polling numbers do not include the islands separately and what little demographic data exists tend to just declare the population to be 100% Christian. My personal estimate is in the 0.5-2% range.
Turks and Caicos Islands - No reliable data; their does not seem to be any recent official polling on religious demography and what exists lumps everything that's not Christianity into a single 'Other' category. My personal estimate is in the 2-10% range.
Vietnam - No reliable data; the most recent census (2018) includes Irreligious groups and groups practicing Indigenous Beliefs (which is a substantial group) in the same category, additionally no recent NGO polling exists. My personal estimate is in the 55-75% range.

This colour scheme sucks to follow I think you should get a different one honestly man, like red to orange to yellow. The concept is really good though and the research seems good.

 

[iori]

This colour scheme sucks to follow I think you should get a different one honestly man, like red to orange to yellow. The concept is really good though and the research seems good.

The original color key used gradation of a single color, however that made the map incredibly difficult to read as it lead to to many shades that were similar to each other, additionally the colors move along the color wheel and I take into account color psychology, the cooler a color or shade is the more it's understood as calm or good, where-as hotter colors and shades tend to be the opposite, hence the use of shades of purple moves to shades of darker blue which moves to shades of blue that are closer to green.

 

[Beatriz]

is the historical prevalence of mahayana buddhism as opposed to theravada more likely to result in a country becoming irreligious

 

[vgh...]

The original color key used gradation of a single color, however that made the map incredibly difficult to read as it lead to to many shades that were similar to each other, additionally the colors move along the color wheel and I take into account color psychology, the cooler a color or shade is the more it's understood as calm or good, where-as hotter colors and shades tend to be the opposite, hence the use of shades of purple moves to shades of darker blue which moves to shades of blue that are closer to green.

Idk what about something like this where the shades are distinct enough and pile up next to each other enough that you can sort of tell? (not my work obviously, credit to iori for putting this thing together.

90% of people will not think of colour wheels and cool and warm colours (that makes me think of nice landscape paintings more than maps) when they see your map I think, it just fries our poor peanut brains. I'm a bit of a monkey and I want to be able to discern a general pattern within a few seconds with something a bit starker and that I'm a bit more used to. Your colour scheme is actually smart and has reasoning behind it, but in my humble opinion you've overthought it. The BIGGEST problem imo is the way it goes from light to dark shades and then back again. <1%, 10-19.9% and 50-59.9 are all lighter than surrounding colours and it takes more concentration to discern stuff. I also couldn't tell whether North Korea was 90-100% or insufficient data for a bit.

 

[iori]

View attachment 898326
Idk what about something like this where the shades are distinct enough and pile up next to each other enough that you can sort of tell? (not my work obviously, credit to iori for putting this thing together.

90% of people will not think of colour wheels and cool and warm colours (that makes me think of nice landscape paintings more than maps) when they see your map I think, it just fries our poor peanut brains. I'm a bit of a monkey and I want to be able to discern a general pattern within a few seconds with something a bit starker and that I'm a bit more used to. Your colour scheme is actually smart and has reasoning behind it, but in my humble opinion you've overthought it. The BIGGEST problem imo is the way it goes from light to dark shades and then back again. <1%, 10-19.9% and 50-59.9 are all lighter than surrounding colours and it takes more concentration to discern stuff. I also couldn't tell whether North Korea was 90-100% or insufficient data for a bit.

Honestly the coloration I choose is also based on my own aesthetic, and, outside some specific maps, I just don't like using lots of shades of reds and oranges and yellows.

 

[iori]

is the historical prevalence of mahayana buddhism as opposed to theravada more likely to result in a country becoming irreligious

Not really, it's really more coincidence then anything.

 

[FesteringSpore]

Cross-posting from the MOTF thread, as usual. Comments, questions, anything is welcomed!​

the former United States of America
100 Years After the Rise of the Dead​

Basically, my idea for this scenario is the aftermath of a zombie apocalypse, where zombies are still very much a threat and force most people to live in well-guarded walled communities. Hence fulfilling the goal of a city-state world after a global disaster. And I decided on the mainland USA because it is a region without a real history of city-states, but that I could envision as having an interesting one to tell.

The question then became - from where would those cities arise? Building them simply from already existing cities is not only somewhat implausible to envision but, worse yet, would be quite boring, essentially making it a copy of the OTL map of the US. So I decided instead to look to military bases, forts and outposts as the centers of this new civilization. It is somewhat sensible, I think, that military bases, already secured and already well-armed, would become, in a zombie apocalypse, more likely to withstand and to maintain themselves going.

So, I went it with. I researched through hundreds of military bases in US soil, and used their active duty personnel as a baseline for their population-in-setting. I listed, researched and placed in the map almost 300 different places. Hard work, but I think it benefited the map. This allowed for an interesting diversity, with some cities becoming quite more predominant than others, and some regions seemingly surviving better than others. And, through working with trade lines (through existing highways, railways and rivers) it created an interesting map, with a lot to explore.

In fact, what I like the most about this map is the lore potential. Imagine the amount of stories that might exist beneath the surface. What is life under a very militarized society, constantly vigilant against the living dead and about the risk of infection? How might relationships between neighbouring cities be? And this society wouldn't be at all static - from the map already it is possible to imagine probable regions bound to be united as regional states in the future, in ways we probably wouldn't foresee looking at a OTL State boundary maps or just from OTL city demographics.

Another interesting question would be - what exists beyond the cities, besides the dead? I can only imagine that there would be countless communities living outside the jurisdiction of these militarized cities. I have come to call them "hillbillies", a term like the Greco-Roman "barbarian" in sense, and I imagine there is a lot to say about their relations with the city dwellers, between trade, raids and whatever else.

Finally, there is how culture would evolve and diverge in this world. How might language evolve? I could imagine the various languages of North America becoming the foundation of their own language families. And of course, there is the question of how religion might deal with both the zombie apocalypse and its aftermath. That Utah exists quite isolated from the rest of the continent, for one, is quite interesting from a religious perspective.

You might be asking: what about Canada? I'm afraid Canada didn't make it (Ok, kidding, really my base map didn't include Canadian landmarks and I didn't have the extra time to research it enough)

Anyway, this is my map, I hope you liked it. It was a fun project to make up, even if researching and then proceeding to meticulously write down military bases and their personnel size probably put me on some list.

How was San Diego able to survive while only losing 100,000 people?

 

[Lord Hierarch]

A24 Civil War Movie Map - Screenshot

Texas and California are sitting in a tree

K-I-S-S-LMNOP.

....

Wait.

 

[ajdb0614]

I absolutely love this. Do you have any lore for the rest of the world?

I was actually working on a Worlda when I started to get stumped past Europe and (most of) the Americas, and I also got an urge to figure out Germany's internals leading to the map as you see here. Some of the more definitive and solid ideas I have at the moment are:

1. There being multiple Hanoverian monarchies, namely Canada, Australia and New Zealand. And no, not a Commonwealth Realm situation where the monarch of the UK is also monarch of these countries. They outright have their own monarchs. As in there's a Canadian King of Canada reigning in Ottawa and so on and forth.
2. 1812 went real belly up for the United States, though they eventually recovered and then took more out of Mexico come a delayed Mex-Am War in the 1850s (plus some additional southwards expansions in the Caribbean). An alternate Civil War in the 1870s also radically altered the place, it being a (successful) Northern (and Western) Free Soiler revolution than a suppression of an attempted Southern secession. Suffice to say, the present USA of TTL is a notably more multicultural/racial entity compared to OTL. "Significantly more Hispanic and somewhat more Black" is one way to put it. I also envision American politics taking a somewhat bizzare turn relative to OTL. It's still a system dominated by two major parties (said parties being the Federalists and Democratic-Republicans), though with a healthier third party ecosystem, no first past the post, and... an unholy proportional distribution of electoral votes during presidential elections.
   
   Spoiler: The US (and Canada) ITTL

   
3. "Portugal" and Canada might not be the only monarchies in the Americas. Depending on what I decide to settle on regarding the Andes, there may be a (Neo?)Neo-Incan Peruvian Empire presently existing ITTL. Whether or not this was the result of Tupac Amaru II or his family having better fortunes ITTL or the result of a strange LARP on the part of a later revolutionary, I'm not so sure. Neither am I certain if it should still be a thing or, in accordance to the recurring gag regarding a supporting character in the Suite Life that led me to consider its inclusion, fallen to republican revolution; the latter option leaving open the chance for a messy and farcical attempt at a restoration somewhere down the line.
4. Patagonia is Chilean ITTL. Argentina still claims the Falklands in spite of this.
5. The colonization of Africa saw a more "British Raj" esque reliance on protectorate and client monarchs, which has led to a significant number of independent kingdoms and chiefdoms existing in TTL's present day. Debating on whether or not Angola is still "Portuguese" or if the place has gone its own way (potentially with a local-born Braganza attempting to pull his own Pedro I during its independence).
6. Things went very, very badly for the First (and only) Saudi State, and Wahhabism pretty much tripped and fatally cracked its head on a rock during its adolescence. A Neo-Sufist wave took the place of what would have been the flowering of Salafism IOTL.
7. As an additional ideological side-note, Marx and Marxism still do exist ITTL, but the success of various liberal revolutions stymied some of his radicalism. Socialism ITTL takes on a somewhat more "utopian socialist" bend relative to the OTL monopoly of "scientific socialism", democratic and libertarian schools of it being the mainstream (of course, that's not to say revolutionary or authoritarian schools don't exist ITTL, it's just they are on the relative fringe of it).
8. The Grand Mughal in Delhi reigns as the Kaisar-i-Hind, that bit is certain (still figuring out the "how" of that). Also certain is the fact that India's internal boundaries, with its many princely states, makes cartographers everywhere want to cry whenever they have to draw it accurately.
9. I also have an idea that China presently has three competing claimants to the Mandate of Heaven after something happened to the Qing. There's an "Imperial China" with its capital in Beijing, another in Nanjing, and the third centered in Xi'an/Chang'an. It's abit like the PRC/ROC, except recognition of who's the "real China" is somewhat more evenly distributed, though most nations go for a "recognize all" approach (with a few "recognize nones" sprinkled here and there). Furthermore, none of the claimant dynasties are ethnically Han.

This is very cool. I would love to see more of this scenario.

Thanks. I certainly hope I eventually manage to cook up more ideas for the global Worlda of it.

Almost surprising we don’t have people trying for a Disney Channel styled map. It would be so easy to expand Monaco into Nice and have Princes and Princesses come from there.

Did briefly consider going for that, with a craptonne of micro states, some fictitious and in ahistorical geologies (i.e. - nonexistent IRL peninsulae and islands). Ultimately I've decided to keep it relatively grounded, with the "Disney Channel vibe" coming in the form of a general optimistic vibe, monarchies existing everywhere (to the point that constitutional monarchism is TTL's dominant form of government), and a generally implied to be significantly more tolerant and progressive than OTL global social outlook.

Oh, and there may or may not be an international academy somewhere in the Alps where a bunch of royal tweens goof off and commit many antics that may or may not generate a international diplomatic incident once or twice a semester.

So, Italy gets French and German speaking Valais/Wallis/Sion, but not Italian-speaking Ticino right next door?

Something, something, "eccentricities of alternate post-Napoloenic border settlement".

 

[DUWANG]

Should probably be posting this in WIP Map Thread, but I've been lurking these threads for like 15 years and it feels good to finally post anything.

Hopefully this is the start of a much more ambitious "realistic Kaiserreich" map scenario, but for now its just experimenting with making a custom color scheme that actually matches the look I had it my head.

Full appropriate credits to LibraryofAlexandria, CHKeeley, Javonicus, and the usual cast of characters for all the Worlda borders & internals.

As far as I know the United Baltic Duchies or a "free" Latvia was always supposed to also receive the Latgale region.

 

[CastilloVerde]

Castilloverde! I hadn't noticed you were the author of this map!
You've done an incredible job! How long did it take you to complete these maps?
I have many questions, but the first one that comes to mind is what font you used for the different texts on the key.

Thanks! Sorry for the late reply.
The entire project took about 4 months, but I worked on it on-and-off during this time.
I used 04b03 for most of the text font, though I used Nyala as the font for the text headings.

 

[WheelyWheelyLegsNoFeely]

The Grand Mughal in Delhi reigns as the Kaisar-i-Hind, that bit is certain (still figuring out the "how" of that).

If you need any advice, this historical event could provide some inspiration.

 

[vgh...]

Something, something, "eccentricities of alternate post-Napoloenic border settlement".

Napoleon did annex the Canton of Valais for the strategically-important Simplon Pass in the Alps (going as far as to rename it to the Department of Simplon), so maybe it's more than just an eccentricity that place has changed hands like it has.

 

[Baconheimer]

Working on a little timeline. Here is a map of US state name origins.

 

[Somebody-Someone]

There was a map somewhere about a Maya archaeological site in Florida (I think). Where is it?

 

[Keperry]

There was a map somewhere about a Maya archaeological site in Florida (I think). Where is it?

https://www.deviantart.com/fossilds/art/Sanibel-National-Park-955464230

 

[Emperor-of-New-Zealand]

Texas and California are sitting in a tree

As far as I know (which isn't much, I've read the barest amount about this production - I'm not even sure if it's a TV series or a movie, actually) Texas and California are "independent" in the setting, or neutral or something. As part of the showrunner's efforts to make it not a reflection of real-world divisions (where, I guess, California and Texas stand as two conceptual powerhouses on opposite ends of the American political spectrum, such as it is).

 

[vgh...]

As far as I know (which isn't much, I've read the barest amount about this production - I'm not even sure if it's a TV series or a movie, actually) Texas and California are "independent" in the setting, or neutral or something. As part of the showrunner's efforts to make it not a reflection of real-world divisions (where, I guess, California and Texas stand as two conceptual powerhouses on opposite ends of the American political spectrum, such as it is).

I heard somebody say that the reason the divisions look so dumb is because the writers of the show purposefully wanted to avoid highlighting real political divisions in the USA

 

[Nizam]

4 more overcomplicated and byzantine empires

Here's the rest of them: https://www.deviantart.com/nizamz7/gallery/89818534/byzantine-empires

 

[Lottie]

I've looked in the forum list and even used 'search' function, but Ican't find the political map thread.Does anyone have a linh t0 it?