Some appropriate music, as Sorairo posts the final chapter in his time here in the forum.
Bush vs. The Axis of Evil - TL
Some appropriate music, as Sorairo posts the final chapter in his time here in the forum.
On the one hand, this is a much more dangerous world than ours, and our ITTL equivalents will have spent their formative years first living through the War on Terror and then the superpowers once more glaring at each other over borders. To say nothing of Korea starting to become a nuclear-armed theocracy and various other countries not being in a good place.
On the other hand, some countries have seen democracy flourish and improve...and while a new Cold War has begun, the lines have been drawn, and the democratic powers won't be backing down to aggression. Which in turn could paradoxically lead to greater stability: as long as the USR and China know that the democratic powers aren't weak and have shaken off the peace dividend torpor - and especially now that Poland and Japan have their own deterrents - they won't go trying anything overt, it'll be back to the days of proxy wars.
And all in all, a very good TL @Sorairo - well done.
Will you be doing a final 'country list' like you did with your two previous TLs?
On the other hand, some countries have seen democracy flourish and improve...and while a new Cold War has begun, the lines have been drawn, and the democratic powers won't be backing down to aggression. Which in turn could paradoxically lead to greater stability: as long as the USR and China know that the democratic powers aren't weak and have shaken off the peace dividend torpor - and especially now that Poland and Japan have their own deterrents - they won't go trying anything overt, it'll be back to the days of proxy wars.
And all in all, a very good TL @Sorairo - well done.
Will you be doing a final 'country list' like you did with your two previous TLs?
Though the Second Cold War being more tense than OTL has some unfortunate implications in the field of how this world tackles climate change, especially as America and the USR/China are even less likely to cooperate on climate issues than OTL.
I cannot wait to see the world map version of the TL together with the spheres of influence/blocs as well as highlights.
What happened to the CSTO (Collective Security Organization), the SCO, and the CIS at the onset of the Cold War II?
What happened to the CSTO (Collective Security Organization), the SCO, and the CIS at the onset of the Cold War II?
And how does the Suez Canal, a contentious conflict between the military dictatorship in the Sinai and the Muslim Brotherhood-led regime affect international shipping as well as maritime traffic?
The canal itself may become a war zone which could lead to a devastating global impact on the world economy in the long run as the Suez is a center for maritime traffic that connects Europe and Asia by way of trading goods or transporting raw materials, assembled and finished goods by ship would be somewhat risky and I guess the canal should be served as a part of the international zone that can be used as a buffer between the two rival claimants to Egypt, just like how Constantinople/Istanbul was considered a 'neutral zone' due to the main maritime traffic for ships that passes through the Bosporus Strait into the Sea of Marmara.
On that note, how do you see Indonesian foreign policy developing in TTL's Second Cold War, then?
"Rowing between the two Reefs" would actually mean something here.
The lack of resource boom ITTL means that Indonesia would recover slower from the Krismon during SBY's first term, and 2009 Election could have more a close-run thing with ultimately SBY just barely got through with 52-55% victory. On the upside, the corruption cases would probably toned down a bit with the slumping of the economy as everyone is worrying... or not (?).
Would the Non-Aligned Movement gained more members in the American Retreat and the Emergence of The Partnership? Probably not with Indonesia still recovering by 2013.
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Could see that happening, though it will inevitably face the same issues that the NAM faced during the Cold War: that being that they ultimately have very little in common aside from being unaligned. No common border, no common economic realities, etc. I think we could see a broader global bloc of countries united by a mutual desire to play off both sides of the Cold War against each other like India right now IOTL.
Thank you for writing this TTL to the end. Really great job, in my opinion yours best (barely but still; the Death of Russia gave a strong rivalry) story. The only thing I reserve for the whole is the final name of the confederal state of Russia, Belarus and Ukraine - its name is a bit offensive to me towards other Slavic nations. I would prefer something like "the Union of Ruthenian Slavic Republics", " the Union of East Slavic Republics/States" or ,,the Union of Confederated Ruthenian Republics''.
I like this story and thank you Sorairo for making this. I’m still not sure about the logic of Bush being re-elected? The guy who created the circumstances for the rise of China/Russia, now be expected the same messes he made. This is the logic of recruiting the burglar who robbed someone’s house, and expecting him to be able to stop someone else’s thievery. Even though he has no idea how to stop their rise, it was his stupidity that lead to diplomatic isolating his country from most of the world, and he directly killed millions of people in his invasions including women and children (he didn’t even catch the guy who started 9/11). No matter how you sugarcoat it, he’s still a war criminal whose policies were terrible both at home (terrible handling of the economy and tax-cuts for the rich), and abroad (those millions of people). It would have been smarter if they recruited a more intelligent less controversial non-Neo con Republican, but no one in that party apparently had the brains to think of that.
Ultimately I wouldn’t say this a good ending, Wellstone got shafted for the crime of having a terrible vice-president he was forced to accept. Bush is continuing the tradition of warmongering for profits under the guise of “limited intervention”, the arsenal of democracy being as selective in its support of democracy as usual. Putin got everything he wanted from Bush, and is now the most popular Russian president in history. China isn’t going to back down now thanks to the Korean incident, and is now more angry than ever. All the dictatorships in the world, now have more justification then ever to do horrible things to their people. All the dictators have to say now is “At least I didn’t break three countries for oil or was willing to use nukes on a beaten country”. Now there will another Cold War that will undoubtedly kill millions of people, and the Republicans/Democrats will continue it until it’s no longer profitable. This is the best timeline of the three for the common people of the world, and it still pretty dystopian.
Ultimately I wouldn’t say this a good ending, Wellstone got shafted for the crime of having a terrible vice-president he was forced to accept. Bush is continuing the tradition of warmongering for profits under the guise of “limited intervention”, the arsenal of democracy being as selective in its support of democracy as usual. Putin got everything he wanted from Bush, and is now the most popular Russian president in history. China isn’t going to back down now thanks to the Korean incident, and is now more angry than ever. All the dictatorships in the world, now have more justification then ever to do horrible things to their people. All the dictators have to say now is “At least I didn’t break three countries for oil or was willing to use nukes on a beaten country”. Now there will another Cold War that will undoubtedly kill millions of people, and the Republicans/Democrats will continue it until it’s no longer profitable. This is the best timeline of the three for the common people of the world, and it still pretty dystopian.
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He's a war time president and ITTL he's perceived as having "won" the War on Terror as there is no US troops stuck abroad and the countries he intentionally invaded(Lebanon, Iran & Iraq) have been "successfully" westernized as seen with the olympics, while North Korea which was a wild card still got beaten
So it makes sense to me that after everyone shat on his Wellstone with his presidency being ultimately undermined to the point of being compared to Carter that Bush would be lionised and his leadership during Post 9/11 seen in a more romantic light
The "Bush didnt choose this, he just wanted to be your average christian president but those darn terrorists forced his hand!" we see sometimes IOTL combo'ed with "see? He left things better than when he came"(*ignores the death toll*) that would be a thing ITTL while the consequences of his rule that his successsor had to deal with are brushed off as said successor's fault - "Bush would have handled it better"
So...
Yeah
That is this world's early 21th century
The "Bush Era"
AlgarveChuro
Banned
Bush 2012 sounds bad until you realize they dodged John "Tokyo Rose of Hanoi" McCain because his heart imploded.
Huh this context is a bit of a misuse of the term.I was laconically trying to say "what a finish!"
By the way, could we have an Images from the Bush vs. Axis of Evil thread in the future?
I think the thing with Sorairo's timelines is that his timelines are never intended to be utopias or full dystopias. Sure, many can rage at Bush for returning from the presidency after he was discredited, but then Americans have few other choices in this timeline.
I think the thing with Sorairo's timelines is that his timelines are never intended to be utopias or full dystopias. Sure, many can rage at Bush for returning from the presidency after he was discredited, but then Americans have few other choices in this timeline.
There’s plenty of choices in politics. The idea that a country with over 300 million people doesn’t have the candidates to replace Bush is laughable. The fear of choosing someone who isn’t publicly known over someone who is infamously known makes little sense (that logic lead to the American civil war). Why would you choose someone who created so much havoc in the world over someone who’d be obscure but comparably make less controversies or destruction. Is not that there isn’t any options, it’s the fact the political parties have neither the interest nor the creativity of having a better alternative. So they have to choose “strong” Bush so he can invade more countries on a limited scale, rather than someone much more moderate that is not a fossil.
Glad to see Bush Jr. making the greatest political comeback since Nixon in 1968. Thankfully, he no longer has Cheney and the neocons this time around as he realized they manipulated and fooled him. Speaking of which, how are Cheney, Wolfowitz, Perle, Gaffney and even that nutjob Bolton doing at this point? Maybe to ambassadorships in Israel, Iran, or in Korea or better still permanently retired from politics?