Wrapped in Flames: The Great American War and Beyond

Eeeeeee it's back!

Gurkhas fighting against Union soldiers would have been awesome and terrifying to behold, but gotta agree it would be practically impossible. I do wonder if there would be any changes to the role of GG ITTL Canadian Confederation, with fears regarding the US being justified now I wonder if they'll try for a stronger royal connection. I can't see Canada getting it's own King/Queen under an Imperial Empress, but I wonder if the role of GG will be offered instead to a member of the Royal Family? One of the younger sons or maybe a cousin? Start a tradition of a Dominion GG being offered to a Royal?
 
I can for certain say that Palmerston would love to change up the Maine boundary (he called it the Ashburton Surrender) and is keenly aware of the need to get the frontier there a bit more defensible, it was indeed something that was well known OTL so the chance to change it will be leapt at. He's looking for harsh terms, but perhaps not so harsh it would make the Union feel like fighting to the death. The Cabinet is, broadly, behind him in being punitive.

In the West...well that's more up in the air. The main question might be what they gain from an expanded colonial holding out that way? There's certainly men on the ground (Douglas, if you remember from Chapter 42) who want the expanded territory there. Certainly people in the Hudson's Bay Company - the only real organization with British control between the Muskokas and the Rockies - wouldn't mind the extra money. However, it remains to be seen whether London is necessarily interested in enforcing that with effort in men and ships. They will have some other pressing issues in the Pacific that take up their attention in 1864...
The question is how many miles is "more defensible" for the road in question ( Halifax–Quebec road route). And would a "Peace with the UK in exchange for the British claims in Maine" be something that Lincoln would take?

I think it is case where the amount that the British would gain by grabbing Seattle is less than the United States would lose.

I think the Council of Assiniboia might disagree with your statement. :)

Ah, so the Russians join the war? :) (Is this the "Beyond"?)
 
Was there anything that the U.S. could offer to the U.K. that would get a promise of no recognition of the C.S.A.? British domination of the Sandwich Islands? A blind eye to British interference in South America?
 
Am I the only one who was thinking that this will lead to multiple Canadas, with the Maritimes choosing to form a separate Confederation?
 
Eeeeeee it's back!

Gurkhas fighting against Union soldiers would have been awesome and terrifying to behold, but gotta agree it would be practically impossible. I do wonder if there would be any changes to the role of GG ITTL Canadian Confederation, with fears regarding the US being justified now I wonder if they'll try for a stronger royal connection. I can't see Canada getting it's own King/Queen under an Imperial Empress, but I wonder if the role of GG will be offered instead to a member of the Royal Family? One of the younger sons or maybe a cousin? Start a tradition of a Dominion GG being offered to a Royal?

I'm glad you're happy to see it back!

It would have been cool, but then I very much would have been following the "rule of cool" as it were.

Well, getting a royal to Canada would take some doing. It didn't really have anything like the prestige or the social life Europe or even India might offer, and it would be still in the stages of reparing itself from a pretty bad war. We've only ever had one royal - the Duke of Connaught - do so. It might be something Canada could pine after here, but I have to doubt any royals would be really eager to do it.

There could be some precedent set doing something like that, but it's a bit of an outlier.
 
The question is how many miles is "more defensible" for the road in question ( Halifax–Quebec road route). And would a "Peace with the UK in exchange for the British claims in Maine" be something that Lincoln would take?

It's an open question. Lincoln wants peace, that much is clear. They survived the campaigns of 1863, but there's no guarantee they can survive the campaigns of 1864 if they keep fighting a two front transcontinental war like this. Terrible manpower losses, draft riots, and recaltriant state governments may ruin them! But accepting an extremely punitive treaty would also be political suicide for the Union. Much is dependent on how cheap the peace Britain demands is, and how much Lincoln can willingly sacrifice.

Going into 1864 Lincoln is up for reelection, and there's plenty of people inside and outside of the Republican Party who would like to see him gone. There's going to be a lot of rancor whatever Lincoln does, so it may be in his interest to even take a not cheap peace.

Realistically, both sides are pretty well exhausted. Britain would like peace, and so would the US. The war has not been cheap on either side of the Atlantic, and while the US has been paying far more in terms of economics and the butchers bill, the price for Britain has not been cheap either. Though both sides really have to sit down and ask the question, what does prolonging the conflict get them? In terms of results, not much on the US side and not much on the British side. For the US it doesn't help that even if a peace is signed they have to turn right around and keep trying to crush the Confederacy.

I think it is case where the amount that the British would gain by grabbing Seattle is less than the United States would lose.

There's certainly a fair argument to be made there. How much is Washington Territory even worth in the 1860s anyways? It might be a very big question in Washington the City.

I think the Council of Assiniboia might disagree with your statement. :)

That they would! The losses they have incurred in this war, including those in the Red River Campaign, have meant that they will very much feel entitled to a say in how the potential admission of the Red River Colony would be. There's some who might not agree with that however. Let us just say though, that TTL the Metis are very aware that they bled and died to keep the Union Jack flying above Fort Garry, and they may bleed and die again to make sure they have their say in whatever happens to Hudson's Bay Company property.

Ah, so the Russians join the war? :) (Is this the "Beyond"?)

You couldn't pay the Russians to get involved in this conflict! Russia was very much not able to intervene, with her navy having barely a dozen modern steam warships, the army in significant need of reform, and a lot of economic dislocation from Alexander II deciding to emancipate the serfs. There's simmering unrest in Poland, plenty of unrest in the Far East, and a lot of financial headaches that need to be addressed. They are however, very interested in diplomatically aiding the United States...

The "Beyond" part refers to the world outside the US, which will be having some pretty big butterflies in the next year! Eagle eyed readers will catch a few of those changes when I post the "Year in Review" section soon and then when I open the year 1864 with some negotiations somewhere in Europe...

Was there anything that the U.S. could offer to the U.K. that would get a promise of no recognition of the C.S.A.? British domination of the Sandwich Islands? A blind eye to British interference in South America?

The conundrum the US currently faces (ironically, much like at Ghent in 1814) is that the US isn't in a position, despite two years of of bloodshed, to make the British do anything. Much like how that treaty didn't really address the issue of impressment, or really the complaint that the British were aiding the Indigenous peoples, this one might not really cover off the issues Washington feels is important because they don't have much leverage to push for them. They control little bits of Canada West, but the British are squatting on much of Maine, much of the territory in the Pacific and the only city that matters in San Francisco. There's also nothing they could do to stop the British from just outright annexing the Sandwich Islands (although their current King doesn't hate that idea) or recognizing the Confederacy. Rather, the British are reluctant to do some of those things themselves. Truth be told, the US doesn't have a lot to offer the European powers in this period except as a hypothetical counterweight in the Americas. The United States was a nation in the period who, while very much considered, was not necessarily consulted on what the European powers felt was important.

For instance, OTL because of the Civil War, France felt that they could install a client state in Mexico, the Spanish were trying to annex the Dominican and mucking about in their old South American colonies, and otherwise people didn't really respect the Monroe Doctrine. And the US is hardly in a position to charge across the sea and offer direct support to the other powers. In essence, Britain holds almost all the diplomatic cards and has a very long history of playing them well. With the US fighting for its life, anything it tries to get from Europe would come with the not so innocuous question "Okay, but what's in it for me?" from others.

As a side effect, they may have also irked a few people who might be sympathetic to them because they (rightly) put the war for survival at stake rather than respecting diplomatic niceties.
 
Am I the only one who was thinking that this will lead to multiple Canadas, with the Maritimes choosing to form a separate Confederation?

Well the idea of multiple separate Canadas isn't implausible, it's one that has a bit of a chink in it. New Brunswick is very much connected to Canada now through the shared outpouring of blood, and nearly by railroad. That's enough to drive them fairly close to one another. The other Maritime Provinces (PEI, Newfoundland and Nova Scotia) have enough mental and physical difference that going it alone might hold some traction. On the Pacific you have the vast distances, but a few people have thought about that...
 
I keep making the mistake of thinking 1860s America is 1900s America. And so they have influence and power beyond their shores.
 
I keep making the mistake of thinking 1860s America is 1900s America. And so they have influence and power beyond their shores.

Its not uncommon. I've had more than a few interactions over the years with some rather strange ideas on what the US might offer foreign powers in the civil war if Britain intervened. Ranging from backing a non-existent Germany to telling the French it's okay to invade Mexico. Telling France to keep doing what they were doing anyway is hardly a diplomatic masterpiece.

Its similar to how we get occasional threads about turning the Civil War into a world war, unlike say 1756 or 1914 the Great Powers of the day don't have any reason to pile into the conflict, far more pressing issues closer to home, and almost no stake in North America. It's situation that doesn't lend itself to a global conflict.

It is hard to remember that, until the end of the civil war, the United States was a bit of a military pygmy, the European powers cant be blamed for overlooking it. The army was always small by European standards and the USN was not exactly enormous either. The Civil War finally showed the true strength of the US if push came to shove which gave European powers a bit more pause. Before the war the British had a policy of keeping roughly 1/3 the number of troops in North America as the size of the US army. That became a superfluous policy post 1861 when the size of the armies the US could muster became apparent.
 
Lemon Hill, Philadelphia,
October 31st, 1863


Lincoln could not sleep. He had sent orders to his agents in Europe to negotiate peace, but he had no idea if those orders were being followed, or even if the British were preparing for peace. He was not even in what was, ostensibly, his home. Much as he wanted to return to Washington to show the world the United States was not defeated, he could not deny the logic of his advisors who warned him that the Confederate forces still lurking near Annapolis presented a problem. Should he be captured, the whole nation might take yet another blow to their morale they could ill afford.

Or perhaps they will celebrate, he thought wryly, I fear I am unpopular.

It was sadly true. Though he was still cheered in Philadelphia, the riots in so many cities over the month of August had shown him that he was not as universally beloved as a man leading his country in war might hope. Idly, he wondered how James Madison had felt when he had fled Washington in 1814, or when he had learned the people of New England might secede because they hated that war as much.

Mr. Madison’s War they’d called it. The Copperhead newspapers now were calling this war “Mr. Lincoln’s War” and he’d heard the term had been much abused in Albany the month prior. Lincoln twisted his mouth angrily, how could men claim to be patriots when they plotted to make peace with their neighbors' enemies? So far as he understood it, the men who had met in Albany were naught but scoundrels. They wished for the South to go free so they could fight the British, but he was sure they would make peace with England as soon as was practical and declare that all the death and destruction were the fault of the Republicans who had brought the nation, nay, the continent to war, and for what?

The familiar feeling of melancholy, the melancholy he had felt so much since poor Mary had died, settled on him like a familiar coat. A poorly made coat that itched and scratched to be sure, but a coat he wore nonetheless. The shroud would settle, and it would pass, that was what made these nights so haunting. He missed Mrs. Keckley’s company on nights like these. They both knew loss. Her only son eaten by the war in 1861, and his wife only a few months later in 1862. Lincoln at least had his sons, but poor Mrs. Keckley had no husband, and the less speculated upon who her poor boy’s father was, the better for Lincoln’s mind.

He shivered, and belatedly realized it had nothing to do with his melancholy. Oddly, a breeze was blowing from the great windows.

Lincoln frowned, surely they would all be shut up tight? The October chill was setting in, and there were still warm embers in the fireplaces in the home. What servant could be so lazy as to leave a window open? Seeing no sense in rousing someone, he stalked towards the breeze. On his way he passed his self-proclaimed bodyguard, Lamon. The man was surely in a tense mood, for he sat staring straight ahead, like a statue.

The president smiled as he passed. “There is no need to be so severe on my account Lamon! We have guards enough outside! Rest and make easy!”

Lamon made no reply, he merely sat statue still and stared straight ahead. Perhaps melancholy kept him awake too. Lincoln paused and regarded the man, who showed no sign of acknowledging the leader the nation. Scratching his head, Lincoln carried on. No need to inflict his melancholy on others so late at night.

The source of the breeze was soon located, an open window indeed. The curtains rustled softly in the night air. The world outside was still and silent. It was oppressive, and Lincoln sighed. The cloak of melancholy heavy on him as he reached over and made to close the window, but paused.

On the portico, a man in soldier’s blue lay sprawled on the ground. His rifle was right beneath the window, away from his outstretched hand. Panic suddenly fell on him. Was this why Lamon was so silent and tense? Assassins here in Philadelphia? But then, why had he not given warning? Why was the house not now swarming with soldiers?

Lincoln cautiously picked up the rifle, a bayonet gleaming on the end in the wane light. He hadn’t handled a weapon since his time with the state militia back in 1832. Hopefully he did not need to call on those skills from his brief stint thirty years prior!

Abraham.

He jumped and turned, pointing the bayonet threateningly into the darkness behind him. It was a voice, but there was no speaker. The voice though, it was so familiar.

Abraham, where are you?

Lincoln peered into the gloom. Was it true, was God driving him mad before he destroyed him? Was this his own personal Judgement for his failures? To be mocked by the dead.

“Show yourself! Come out!” He called angrily. He did not believe in seances or spirit talkers. Parlor tricks and shenanigans was all it was. If this was some ill thought joke he would club the trickster with the rifle and remind them of the error of their ways. Maybe send them to be locked in Fort Warren for a time! That might teach the rascals.

Hesitantly, almost demurely, a ghost stepped out of the shadows.

Mary Todd Lincoln was pale, her skin shining bright and dark. She was beautiful though, as beautiful as the day he had laid eyes on her so many years ago. Her hair shone, dark and sleek, there was a roundness to her face he did not remember, and her eyes, her eyes glowed in the dark. The rifle drooped in his hands.

“This cannot be,” he said softly. “I buried you.”

“Oh Abraham, why are you here? Why are you not in Washington, in our house!” She looked suddenly forlorn, and Lincoln’s heart broke in two. “Where are the boys? Where is Willie, Tad, where is Robert?” Fear studded her expression. “You have not sent him to war?”

“No Mary! No! He is safe in Boston, he does not yet wear blue,” Lincoln said, bewildered.

“My sons must never go to war!” She hissed. Her demeanor changed. “Why are we not in Washington? Why are we not home? I searched, and I searched, but you were not there!”

“Mary, my sweet Mary, it was the war,” Lincoln said, not trusting himself to move. “The war has driven us from our home, like so many others. The siege is over though, and in time Rosencrans may drive the rebels back across the Potomac!”

“We must go home Abraham! We must go home!” She crossed the room so quickly she seemed to blur. The dead were surely walking. “Bring the children, we must go home!” She laid a hand on his arm and he gasped. She was cold, cold to the touch.

“Mary! You are so cold, come, come sit by the fire! We can wake the children after we talk.”

His late wife suddenly recoiled again. “No,” she murmured. “Abraham, wake the children, we must go home.”

“Mary, how is it you are here? You died!”

She smiled, coyly in a way he did not remember her smiling in life. It was both sweet, and horrible. “Oh Abraham, I did not die. I was merely sleeping, you buried me too soon.”

Horror gripped him. Had he buried his wife alive? Had he been so wrong and so oblivious? What kind of monster buried his own wife alive? How could he not have been sure?

“Mary, my God! I buried you, buried you alive? How can this be? How did you end up here?”

“He saved me, Abraham,” a fanatical light entered her eyes. “As I lay on death's bed, he came in the night. A bright and shining light! He kissed me and light entered my soul. He told me he would wake me up. And he did, Abraham, he did.”

Rage and fear suddenly coiled in Lincoln’s chest. Some man had dared enter his home, kissed his wife, and then dug her up? It was more than he could bare. Her sudden appearance, this mystery man, he was outraged and angry in ways he had not felt in a long time.

“Speak spirit! Who has sent you here to torment me? Is God truly forsaking me? Why send this angel of judgement to my home?” Lincoln was angrier than he could describe.

Mary tittered in a way she had never laughed in life.

“God? No Abraham, not God. It was a man, more than a man. He knew things, he had seen things. Nero burning the Christians in Rome, Diocletian and his persecutions, the great Sack, and he saw the hypocrisy, the lies!” Mary’s voice rose in a fever pitch. “He had already learned the truth of resurrection, the secrets of Egypt! He whispered them to me, and he sent me to find you, to teach you and the children!”

“This makes no sense Mary,” Lincoln cautiously brought up the rifle again. “Who is this… this man?” He said with venom. No husband should hear his wife speak so, and not so blasphemously.

“He is great Abraham! He is Theophilus! Pure as the snow, powerful as the thunder! He has brought me back and he promises life eternal! Please, Abraham please, let me show you, and the children.” Her eyes were large, pleading, and ever so red.

Lincoln looked into those eyes, those pleading eyes. He did not see his wife. It was something older, far more terrible. That or a soul so tortured he could not endure it. Men were not meant to cross that forbidden River Styx again, to wade back from its dark shores into the world of the living. He shuddered, what had she become?

“Oh Mary,” he said softly. “Can you forgive me?”

She cocked her head. “Forgive you what, Abraham?”

In his youth, Lincoln had been quite the wrestler. His height and reach had given him great advantage. Lincoln knew his strength, and age had not dulled his reflexes. It was surprising, he thought, how he had used weapons just enough to know where his arms should go. The bayonet sprang forward, and struck Mary in the chest. She shrieked in an unearthly wail, a banshee cry, in a voice so unlike his wife’s he knew he had made the right decision. Her small body crumpled and Lincoln fell with it.

He had no idea how long he law on the floor in nothing but his nightshirt, but stomping footsteps were running down the hall towards him. Lamon, previously so stock still burst into the room, his Colt revolver at the ready and a lantern grasped in another hand. Horror washed over his face as he took in the scene.

“Mr. President! My God are you alright?”

With a shuddering breath, Lincoln rose, and looked up. “As alright as a man who has spoken with a ghost may be.” He gazed forlornly at the small, now much older, much less delicate looking form of his dead wife. “I must have taken her through the heart.”

Cautiously, Lamon nudged the body with his boot. It did not stir. He looked as shaken as Lincoln felt.

“It’s the damndest thing sir,” he said, confusion etching his features. “I was standing guard, and suddenly I hear a voice, an impossible voice. It was all I could do not to faint. She… she commanded me to wait. So I sat, and I couldn’t move. Then, all of a sudden the spell was broken.”

Lincoln shook himself out of his reverie. “There’s a man on the portico, please check on him. He may need his rifle back.”

Nodding, Lamon walked to the window and stepped out. A moment later he returned shaking his head. “He’s breathing, and he’s unwounded save for two little marks on his neck.”

Lincoln nodded, feeling grim. He had briefly been able to forget about the war, but now he couldn’t. When it was over, he would have something to do either way. Morning would come, and he would need to bury his wife again.

“We must get him a doctor. Let us hope he says nothing, or I may compel him to secrecy. In the meantime Lamon, I need you to help me with… well, with my wife.”

“To, erm, bury her sir?”

Lincoln shook his head. “No, to burn her. I have no intention that someone should defile her remains again. I do however, intend to find who that someone was, perhaps not this year, or maybe even the next year depending on the election. But I swear to you right now Lamon, I will scour this continent if I must in order to find who disturbed my wife’s eternal rest. The man… no… the creature that tried to use her against me. I won’t rest until I’ve sent them to hell.”
 
Happy Halloween Everyone !
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Hm. And here I was expecting that Lincoln would be assassinated by a confederate sympathizer who had heard of the attempts to make a separate peace between the British Empire and the USA and was planning on trying to make the assassination look like a British plot as to scupper any notions of peace.
 
Abraham Lincoln Vampire Hunter vibes.
Happy Halloween!

I was getting nostalgic for it recently! Happy Halloween!

Hm. And here I was expecting that Lincoln would be assassinated by a confederate sympathizer who had heard of the attempts to make a separate peace between the British Empire and the USA and was planning on trying to make the assassination look like a British plot as to scupper any notions of peace.

A little less canon I'm afraid! We shall see if Lincoln lives out the 1864 election TTL, and whether a certain actor will get a shot in...

After All Hallows Day we shall be getting back to our regularly scheduled alternate history with a little chapter for November 1863, then reviewing the year 1863 and I shall post one of the major updates to begin 1864. After that I'll field the question for what people want to see in the start of 1864.
 
so vampire hunter still gonna be a film in this TLs future ?
loved the supernatural mixed with the mundane feeling .
although I think Lincoln well read that he is would realize it's a demon quicker.
"Theophilus" meaning friend of God.hmm
 
so vampire hunter still gonna be a film in this TLs future ?
loved the supernatural mixed with the mundane feeling .
although I think Lincoln well read that he is would realize it's a demon quicker.
"Theophilus" meaning friend of God.hmm

Probably. We had the book Queen Victoria Demon Hunter OTL so why not have a similar thing here? Though I suppose that will depend on Lincoln's legacy here. Depending on when the negotiations begin at least...
 
Probably. We had the book Queen Victoria Demon Hunter OTL so why not have a similar thing here? Though I suppose that will depend on Lincoln's legacy here. Depending on when the negotiations begin at least...

I mean. even if Lincoln loses
by 2012 he'll be probably be viewed as smart tragic handsome man who despite his best efforts lost due to others failures. people love a good tragedy .
thanks for the book rec!
 
I mean. even if Lincoln loses
by 2012 he'll be probably be viewed as smart tragic handsome man who despite his best efforts lost due to others failures. people love a good tragedy .
thanks for the book rec!

He's definitely going to be seen as a tragic figure in the future, not the least because his wife died right when a trans-Atlantic war was breaking out. Other reasons too...

My pleasure!
 
I wonder how the CSA is going to react once the rumours of a separate peace between the UK and US starts to make the rounds. Granted, there's not much they really can do to sway other nations to their side at this point. Maybe try and get the UK to get them in on those peace talks, but no matter what, they're still going to be quite miffed in Richmond.
 
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